Comments on: Inking Lefties: Noel Arguelles and John Parrish http://kingsofkauffman.com/2010/01/07/inking-lefties-noel-arguelles-and-john-parrish/ A Kansas City Royals Fan Site - News, Blogs, Opinion and More Thu, 29 Nov 2012 02:29:24 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.1 By: Wally Fish http://kingsofkauffman.com/2010/01/07/inking-lefties-noel-arguelles-and-john-parrish/#comment-1216 Wally Fish Sat, 09 Jan 2010 07:19:59 +0000 http://kingsofkauffman.com/?p=2872#comment-1216 Jim Callis had this to say about Chapman on BA, "Chapman never has dominated Cuba's Serie Nacional. He's much more of a thrower than a pitcher." Another BA writer compared him to Royals 2001 1st round pick Colt Griffin and that is not a name you want to be compared to ... ever. John Manuel has "tempered his expectations for him" IMO, he's more hyped than Arguelles because AC allegedly threw over 100 mph in Cuba and he has more experience on the international circuit. Because of that fact, and since he is almost 1.5-2 years younger, Noel isn't as well known. It is worth noting that the highest I've seen Chapman on the radar guns (via reports) since defecting has been 97. Noel tops out at 96 and throws an easy 94. I've never seen either guy pitch obviously so I have no frame of reference. I therefore have to rely on what I read from various sources and consider the credibility of each of those sources. IMO, Arguelles signed for less because he was in the shadow of Chapman. The Royals were very wise to move quickly on him and get him signed before Aroldis signed. If Noel was still on the market after Chapman, his price would have escalated. No matter what happens going forward it is a pretty safe bet that Noel provides the Royals better value than whatever team lands Chapman. I saw teams were up over $20 million on him now. Which to me is just crazy. As is always the case, time will tell ... who knows both could wind up being great. Jim Callis had this to say about Chapman on BA, “Chapman never has dominated Cuba’s Serie Nacional. He’s much more of a thrower than a pitcher.”

Another BA writer compared him to Royals 2001 1st round pick Colt Griffin and that is not a name you want to be compared to … ever.

John Manuel has “tempered his expectations for him”

IMO, he’s more hyped than Arguelles because AC allegedly threw over 100 mph in Cuba and he has more experience on the international circuit. Because of that fact, and since he is almost 1.5-2 years younger, Noel isn’t as well known.

It is worth noting that the highest I’ve seen Chapman on the radar guns (via reports) since defecting has been 97. Noel tops out at 96 and throws an easy 94. I’ve never seen either guy pitch obviously so I have no frame of reference. I therefore have to rely on what I read from various sources and consider the credibility of each of those sources.

IMO, Arguelles signed for less because he was in the shadow of Chapman. The Royals were very wise to move quickly on him and get him signed before Aroldis signed. If Noel was still on the market after Chapman, his price would have escalated.

No matter what happens going forward it is a pretty safe bet that Noel provides the Royals better value than whatever team lands Chapman. I saw teams were up over $20 million on him now. Which to me is just crazy.

As is always the case, time will tell … who knows both could wind up being great.

]]> By: Jays Daze http://kingsofkauffman.com/2010/01/07/inking-lefties-noel-arguelles-and-john-parrish/#comment-1208 Jays Daze Fri, 08 Jan 2010 19:17:43 +0000 http://kingsofkauffman.com/?p=2872#comment-1208 I always enjoy your pieces as well Wally, but we obviously got different information and feelings on these 2 guys. I'll finish up my side of the chatter with this: if Aroldis is actually behind Noel in talent and readiness for MLB, why is it that KC was the only team bidding for Noel while there are reportedly 14-15 that were interested in bidding on Aroldis and 5 who actually put more than double what KC gave Noel on the line for him? I'm not saying scouts are always right - as made obvious by the draft each year, but from what I can tell most teams like Aroldis much more than Noel. I'll be very surprised to see Noel surpass what KC already has in terms of minors SP in Crow-Duffy-Montgomery-Melville who should do well to support Greinke in the near future. That's a kudos to KC for having so much SP minors talent, not a knock on Noel. Just a Jays fan observation - nothing more! Cheers Wally, and keep up the good work eh! I always enjoy your pieces as well Wally, but we obviously got different information and feelings on these 2 guys. I’ll finish up my side of the chatter with this: if Aroldis is actually behind Noel in talent and readiness for MLB, why is it that KC was the only team bidding for Noel while there are reportedly 14-15 that were interested in bidding on Aroldis and 5 who actually put more than double what KC gave Noel on the line for him? I’m not saying scouts are always right – as made obvious by the draft each year, but from what I can tell most teams like Aroldis much more than Noel.

I’ll be very surprised to see Noel surpass what KC already has in terms of minors SP in Crow-Duffy-Montgomery-Melville who should do well to support Greinke in the near future. That’s a kudos to KC for having so much SP minors talent, not a knock on Noel.

Just a Jays fan observation – nothing more!

Cheers Wally, and keep up the good work eh!

]]> By: Wally Fish http://kingsofkauffman.com/2010/01/07/inking-lefties-noel-arguelles-and-john-parrish/#comment-1207 Wally Fish Fri, 08 Jan 2010 15:35:27 +0000 http://kingsofkauffman.com/?p=2872#comment-1207 Daze, I love your work. That said, I completely disagree on Aroldis. I've read many reports that Argulles is the better prospect and Chapman is far from advanced. There is zero chance Chapman can step into a ML rotation anytime soon, and if he does he will get absolutely lit up. Anyone who says otherwise is buying into hype and not reality. Aroldis has had very little success internationally and the team that signs him will probably be wasting a lot of money. Arguelles has a more advanced arsenal, better control, and a better feel for pitching. His talent is in the ballpark of Chapman, and the Royals landed him for 1/2 to 1/3 of the investment it is going to take to land Aroldis. Noel could be pitching in the majors at some point in 2012 and then they'd have another 2 years on his contract with a controlled salary. I believe he would then go into arbitration for his 6th year before becoming a free agent. No matter how you slice it, signing Arguelles was an excellent move by the Royals. He would have been a surefire top 5 pick if he had been in the draft. $7 million dollars for that type of talent is certainly within reason for any team. Crow will arrive in KC late in 2010 or at some point in 2011. Montgomery shouldn't be too far behind him. Duffy, Melville, Lamb, Sample and to a lesser degree Dwyer (not enough data on him in pro ball yet) all look like they have a shot, but the attrition rate of pitching prospects is such that you can never have too many. Cortes has a million dollar arm and a $0.10 head. I'm guessing Arguelles will fare better on and off the field when all is said and done. For what it is worth, the Royals didn't draft Cortes, they got him from the White Sox in the Mike MacDougal trade. I was actually pretty happy the team traded Cortes, but I wish the return had been something better than Yuniesky Betancourt. Especially since the Mariners were looking to basically give Yunie away. Daze,
I love your work. That said, I completely disagree on Aroldis. I’ve read many reports that Argulles is the better prospect and Chapman is far from advanced. There is zero chance Chapman can step into a ML rotation anytime soon, and if he does he will get absolutely lit up. Anyone who says otherwise is buying into hype and not reality. Aroldis has had very little success internationally and the team that signs him will probably be wasting a lot of money.

Arguelles has a more advanced arsenal, better control, and a better feel for pitching. His talent is in the ballpark of Chapman, and the Royals landed him for 1/2 to 1/3 of the investment it is going to take to land Aroldis.

Noel could be pitching in the majors at some point in 2012 and then they’d have another 2 years on his contract with a controlled salary. I believe he would then go into arbitration for his 6th year before becoming a free agent. No matter how you slice it, signing Arguelles was an excellent move by the Royals. He would have been a surefire top 5 pick if he had been in the draft. $7 million dollars for that type of talent is certainly within reason for any team.

Crow will arrive in KC late in 2010 or at some point in 2011. Montgomery shouldn’t be too far behind him. Duffy, Melville, Lamb, Sample and to a lesser degree Dwyer (not enough data on him in pro ball yet) all look like they have a shot, but the attrition rate of pitching prospects is such that you can never have too many.

Cortes has a million dollar arm and a $0.10 head. I’m guessing Arguelles will fare better on and off the field when all is said and done. For what it is worth, the Royals didn’t draft Cortes, they got him from the White Sox in the Mike MacDougal trade.

I was actually pretty happy the team traded Cortes, but I wish the return had been something better than Yuniesky Betancourt. Especially since the Mariners were looking to basically give Yunie away.

]]> By: Jays Daze http://kingsofkauffman.com/2010/01/07/inking-lefties-noel-arguelles-and-john-parrish/#comment-1206 Jays Daze Fri, 08 Jan 2010 11:41:35 +0000 http://kingsofkauffman.com/?p=2872#comment-1206 I'm torn as to whether signing Arguelles to that contract makes sense for the Royals. In a way, they have to try something, regardless of age, to make the team better, but is 5 years too short a period of time for the contract? Unlike Aroldis who can step into a rotation if it's weak enough, Arguelles doesn't have that much experience or talent. Besides, I'm fairly certain that both Aaron Crow and Danny Duffy would get a shot at the rotation before Arguelles would. In a way, it seems to me that Arguelles replaces Daniel Cortes in the minors - or what the Royals had actually wanted to get out of Cortes when they drafted him. I’m torn as to whether signing Arguelles to that contract makes sense for the Royals. In a way, they have to try something, regardless of age, to make the team better, but is 5 years too short a period of time for the contract? Unlike Aroldis who can step into a rotation if it’s weak enough, Arguelles doesn’t have that much experience or talent. Besides, I’m fairly certain that both Aaron Crow and Danny Duffy would get a shot at the rotation before Arguelles would. In a way, it seems to me that Arguelles replaces Daniel Cortes in the minors – or what the Royals had actually wanted to get out of Cortes when they drafted him.

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